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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

By Mayank Sharma on June 20, 2008 (10:00:00 PM)

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Two of the most popular Linux browsers were unveiled this month after years of development -- the open source Firefox 3 and the proprietary Opera 9.5. Opera's launch a week before Firefox was like any other launch, unlike Firefox's much publicized world record attempt. But Opera 9.5 is no less revolutionary than Firefox, matching its open source rival feature for feature, from security-related enhancements to improved multilingual text rendering.

The first thing you notice when you launch Opera 9.5 is that it occupies less desktop real estate than Firefox 3, with less toolbar space and smaller borders, giving you more room to view pages. Opera's nifty features are tucked away in its power panel. Unlike Firefox's panel, which displays only bookmarks and history, Opera's lets you access the built-in file transfer manager, the notes app, widgets (the Web browser equivalent of desktop applets), and other features. You can also see any bookmarked site as a panel as well, or download more Web panels for a variety of tasks, such as browsing news sites or playing games.

If you like to start your browser with multiple tabs, one for your email, a couple for tech and other news, a couple of comics, and so on, you'll love Opera's default start page, called "speed dial." It displays nine customizable buttons that, with a click, will take you to your favorite bookmarked sites. Opera also has a lot of tabbing features and control options, including the Ctrl-Tab cycling control and restoring tabs. You can preview pages open in a tab as well or resize pages within tabs, which lets you see multiple pages in one window.

Another nifty time-saving feature is the wand, which stores autocomplete information, including passwords. Like with the new Firefox, the wand in Opera doesn't interfere with browsing, saving username and passwords in the background while a site continues to load. The wand is better than the "remember password" option in Firefox, because it doesn't autofill the fields and allows you to enter details manually if you want to use different credentials. But if you want to use the stored username and password, just click the wand button, next to the address bar, and it not only fills in the information but also logs you in automatically, saving you another click.

Opera 9.5 also protects you from online fraud and scams with a built-in fraud protection feature. Opera monitors sites you're visiting and checks them against phishing information from Netcraft and PhishTank, and malware protection from Haute Secure. An option in the panel also lets you view details about the site and its security certificate, if it has one. Firefox 3 has similar phishing and malware protection.

Also similar between the two browsers is their ability to replace desktop apps with online counterparts. Both Opera 9.5 and Firefox 3 let you configure a Web-based email account and use it to answer all mailto: protocol requests. Opera 9.5 goes a step further and in fact packs in a complete email client that can also synchronize with a POP or IMAP-based server. This allows you to compose and send messages from within the browser. The email client is well integrated into the browser, and can be launched in a tab from the panel.

In addition to the email client, Opera has lots of features built in that are available only as add-ons for Firefox. For instance, in its note-taking app, you can create multiple notes from scratch, or copy a selected piece of text into a note, arrange notes in folders, and, if the mail client is configured, email them as well. Then there's the download manager, which can not only pause and resume downloads, but is also a full-fledged BitTorrent client. And Opera also bundles an IRC client.

One Firefox 3 feature I miss in Opera 9.5 is the ability to copy multiple text ranges. But it can search a selected word in a dictionary, or translate it to other languages using Yahoo!'s Babel Fish online service. Firefox 3 lets you tag bookmarks; Opera 9.5 doesn't, but it has a quick find feature that remembers the content of every page you visit. So if you forget to bookmark a difficult-to-remember site -- say zedropratodretua.co.za -- you can still find it in your history if you remember bits of its content.

At the bottom of its window Opera 9.5 displays three buttons. The Fit to Width button zooms out a page to help you avoid horizontal scrolling, which is pretty cool if your resolution is lower than 1280x1024. The resizing worked on several sites I tried it on, but not on Gmail. Another button is actually a pull-down menu that lets you select preset zoom levels defined in percentages from 20% to 1,000%. This is good for instantly doubling or tripling the font size, as compared to Firefox, where you have to press the "zoom in" button several times for the same result. But Firefox 3 can remember zoom settings for a particular site, whereas Opera cannot.

The final button on the bottom toolbar helps you disable and re-enable all images on the page. If you want to block other content, an option in the right-click context menu helps you block certain elements like online advertisements.

Opera 9.5 has lots of import and export options. It can import bookmarks from Firefox, Konqueror, and Internet Explorer, and email from older Opera versions and dedicated clients such as Thunderbird, Eudora, or any generic mbox file. You can also use Opera's free Opera Link Web service to sync bookmarks and speed dials between your Opera browsers at work, home, and on your mobile phones. Opera's Knowledge Base has details on these and more features and how to use them, as well as on online help options and premium support for $29.

For Web developers, Opera 9.5 also includes an alpha release of the company's Dragonfly tool, which helps developers debug JavaScript, inspect CSS and the DOM, and view any errors in their apps while they are running over Opera. It both sounds and looks similar to the popular Firebug tool for Firefox.

Testing under the hood

In addition to the user-facing additions, Opera 9.5 also has a new browser engine under the hood. Opera claims to have "made the fastest browser in the world even faster with superior support for Web standards." While Opera 9.5 did render internationalized scripts better than Firefox 3, I put this claim to test with a couple of online benchmarks. I ran all the tests on a machine with an Intel Core 2 Duo 4400 2.0GHz processor with 1GB RAM over Ubuntu 8.04, and on Windows XP (SP2) to check cross-platform support.

First up was the CSS benchmark, and Opera 9.5 on Linux was indeed the fastest of the lot. The test measures the time it takes the browser to render a locally stored page consisting of almost 2,500 positioned DIV tags. The plotted numbers in the CSS test graph are the average of five test runs. Opera 9.5 also passes the ACID 2 test, but, like its peers, fails the ACID 3 benchmark -- but it scored the maximum marks on the ACID 3 test among the tested browsers, as shown in the ACID 3 test graph.

In terms of rendering JavaScript, Firefox 3 had the edge over Opera 9.5 in the SunSpider JavaScript Benchmark, which has an error range between +/-0.8% to +/-11.3% depending on the type of test. In the JavScript Engine speed test, Opera 9.5 scores over its peers when it comes to error handling, DOM, and AJAX. Similarly in the W3C DOM vs. InnerHTML test, designed to find out which method of generating large amounts of content is fastest in the browser, Opera 9.5 fares better than Firefox 3, though Safari on Windows won that test with the quickest time.

Conclusion

Opera 9.5 is full to the brim with features and improvements and highly customizable. By rolling in apps such as the mail client and IRC chat application, and integrating them into a user's browsing experience, Opera 9.5 is a worthy challenger to Firefox 3. It surely has enough power and features to make it my favorite browser. If only it were free software and open source!

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on Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Note: Comments are owned by the poster. We are not responsible for their content.

Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 78.32.219.25] on June 20, 2008 11:00 PM
The main feature of Firefox is that it's Open Source. Proprietary products that only run on a limited set of operating systems and platforms, and can't be audited by users are hardly comparable, never mind equals.

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 96.3.181.200] on June 20, 2008 11:40 PM
Yes, but Opera is compatible on tons of platforms (http://www.opera.com/download/index.dml?custom=yes). Not to mention the new Gecko version dropped support for Windows ME and below, while Opera 9.5 works very well on these platforms - even Windows 95. You have to at least give Opera credit for supporting numerous platforms and operating systems.

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Re(1): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 164.58.126.128] on June 23, 2008 04:35 PM
will opera 9.3 work with my BeOS?

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 84.92.168.41] on June 21, 2008 01:45 AM
"Proprietary products that only run on a limited set of operating systems and platforms, and can't be audited by users are hardly comparable, never mind equals."
Oh, give it up already. Not even slashdot trolls make comments like that anymore. This is a comparison of two software products, side by side, not a silly religious war.

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Re(1): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 200.105.172.181] on June 21, 2008 01:46 PM
"Oh, give it up already. Not even slashdot trolls make comments like that anymore. This is a comparison of two software products, side by side, not a silly religious war."

It's always convenient to make it look like a religious war isn't it? The reality is that picking a martket drug for something as necessary as a web broweser is entirely lame and far from pragmatic. Not considering the long term effects of a decision does not make you pragmatic. Putting blind faith on some random company to keep releasing a browser for free, does NOT make you pragmatic. Should opera remain closed source it will be considered an equivalent to internet explorer, the only difference is that Microsoft didn't make it.

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Re(2): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 86.29.194.31] on June 22, 2008 09:06 PM
Odd, i could swear your phone, car, DVD player, TV, electric alarm clock and a whole host of other gadgets have proprietory software, but i don't see you making a song and dance about it. Oh and seeing as Firefox is open source, i take it that you've had a look at it and that you've contributed to the code base? No? Didn't think so.

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Re(3): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 10.9.2.52] on June 23, 2008 01:27 PM
Proprietary or not, they're both great products. I think we're lucky to have two free choices. Even if one of them is not "free" in the sense of speech, its much more free than the IE equivelant. Opera's browser is only comparable to Microsoft in the sense that the code is kept from the public. Opera has proven over the years to make a much better browser under a much better liscense for a much better price than anything Microsoft has produced.

Firefox has some corporate backing too... but it wouldn't exist if a proprietary company hadn't handed over the codebase for Netscape so many years ago.

Konqueror and Safari are decent too... I think a matter of preference starts flame wars when in the end we all want the same thing.

-Tres

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Re(2): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 32.97.110.142] on June 23, 2008 12:49 PM
"It's always convenient to make it look like a religious war isn't it? The reality is that picking a martket drug for something as necessary as a web broweser is entirely lame and far from pragmatic. Not considering the long term effects of a decision does not make you pragmatic. Putting blind faith on some random company to keep releasing a browser for free, does NOT make you pragmatic."

hmm did someone learn a new word?
check it outi can say it too!! .. pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic pragmatic

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Re(2): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 127.0.0.1] on June 24, 2008 04:54 AM
While I agree, Drupal panels (at least on my server) breaks the new opera (or opera breaks the panels if you prefer). Moreover, font rendering is REALLY ugly. Italic Times looks like it was printed on an old dot matrix machine.

I filed a bug report. Meanwhile, I just created a block to display if opera is detected. Ycccch!

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 70.121.253.104] on June 21, 2008 12:21 PM
@Anonymous [ip: 78.32.219.25] on June 20, 2008 11:00 PM:

Limited set of operating systems and platforms, you say? Opera officially supports both FreeBSD and Solaris as well as every Windows version from 95 and on, and of course Mac and Linux. But that's not all. UIQ, Series 60, Windows Mobile, P2K, Media Highway, Java, Brew, Wii, QnX are some of the many platforms supported by Opera.

How's Firefox doing?


@Anonymous [ip: 151.47.84.127] on June 21, 2008 06:29 AM:

The Opera forums are extremely busy. You can't expect them to reply to every single post. They would be spending all their time in the forums rather than working on the product!

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 71.127.237.204] on June 22, 2008 01:29 AM
Well you should realize that half of the latest/sophisticated FireFox features are copied from Opera.. and the only reason why Opera is so innovative is because its not OpenSource.

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Feature match by Nikita Kondraskov

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 172.17.37.90] on June 22, 2008 01:49 AM
Firefox is copying the Opera browser and they do copy the firefox in response.
This is only natural, because opera was always ahead of their time in the browser market.

They are very open at helping people to mode their stuff.
I guess they could go open source in this decade or so.
Just remember that the developers of Opera also use Linux
and were involved in open source projects a lot.

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 72.39.118.137] on June 23, 2008 04:22 PM
I like free and open source software as much as the next geek, but try and be realistic here. 99% of the computer using population _just doesn't care_ about availability of source code. Computers and the programs we run on them are just tools. Not a philosophy, religion or a way of life. Hell, I'd go so far as to say that most people who use open source software wouldn't know what to do with the source code for anything larger than a "hello world" app, and are not inclined to learn, be it because they're busy with other interests or again, just don't care.

Opera should be judged on its usefulness, speed, security record, standards compliance and ease of use before anything else. And in my experience with it, its been a fantastic browser.

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Re(1): Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 127.0.0.1] on June 24, 2008 05:00 AM
The issue is not the culture of open source. Rather, it is the premise that open source promotes the quality cycle through participative improvement. There are glaring examples in contradiction like KDE4 but, on the whole, it is a proven concept. Apache, MySQL and PHP are huge success stories.

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 192.168.1.11] on June 24, 2008 02:28 PM
I dont think so, There is so many aspect that we can compare, like web rendering speed and other feature. Are you think every user need to read every line of code for their browser? Not every body must see the source because source code just only one aspect in software quality.

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Re: Hardly a feature-for-feature match

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 84.10.185.231] on July 03, 2008 09:51 PM
ble ble ble, you can put this open software in your ass. Mozilla fundation is a normal company which earns milions and milions dollars. Opera runs on any system that practiclly exists. you name it: windows, linux(fedora, ubuntu, red hat, mandrake etc...), unix, windows CE, Brew, symbian, etc etc etc. All together about 19 platforms. Shit it works even on the fridge from I think samsung. They have opera mini which works perfectly on mobile devices and can synchronize your bookmarks with the desktop browser. This is by the way a hammer feature. Leave firefox turn on over nigt you will see how much it is worth. peace of junk. About the other features, you can write widgets in java script for opera. Which is more elastic language than C or C++. You can download for totally free all the widgets from opera community site, Opera is also free. No charges no adverts no nothing. And one more thing. To sell a browser to vendors like telephone companies, or game platforms( like nintendo wii) the browser must by tested by hundreds QAs for thousands hours. This is why I choose opera, couse it is safe and hight quality product for absolutelly free.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 61.69.194.102] on June 21, 2008 02:48 AM
"The first thing you notice when you launch Opera 9.5 is that it occupies less desktop real estate than Firefox 3"

The first thing I noticed was that this is actually wrong based on your screenshot versus my FF 3. Hence I skipped the rest of the article. [Plus, you can get even more vertical space in FF by switching off the bookmark bar (see under "View" menu).]

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Mayank Sharma on June 21, 2008 03:58 AM
The screenshot doesn't show what Opera looks like right after launching. It in fact shows the panel toolbar, the email panel, and a widget. Delete all that and presto...instant desktop real-estate. And unlike "switching off" the bookmarks toolbar, Opera panel slide in/out of view as part of their regular use with a single click. But please still feel free to skip the article.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.132.164.216] on June 21, 2008 05:32 AM
My only objection.. and maybe it's just a misunderstanding... is how do I use TOR with Opera?

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Re: Opera 9.5 and Tor

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 93.197.33.98] on June 21, 2008 09:45 AM
> how do I use TOR with Opera?
The same way you would use it with command line utilities - via a proxy server like privoxy. It also provides some ad-blocking as a side effect.

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 86.75.149.179] on June 22, 2008 03:30 AM
Just look are OperaTor... that's as simple as that ;)
Here -> http://archetwist.com/en/opera/operator

Hibou57 - Yannick

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 76.175.216.126] on June 21, 2008 05:43 AM
Opera never ceases to impress me. They really did a very very nice job as usual. Definitely my browser.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 125.168.48.19] on June 21, 2008 06:10 AM
The only problem with Opera 9.5 was the horrid new theme, thankfully you can still get the old one. Ever since mozilla devs went into denial about non-existant memory leaks that required me to reboot my PC twice a day to recover the lost memory I've been using Opera quite happily, it took some getting used to how things were a little different from firefox but after a few weeks everything hums along nicely. Oh and for a product that wasn't supposed to be so bloated, why is it that Opera has all these features by default and still ends up so much smaller than firefox?

As for free v opensource, does it really matter in this case? After you take into account that spats between mozilla and debian devs among others over patching their precious software and then can no longer make use of trademarks to actively discourage others for distributing modified copies it doesn't seem to make a squat of difference how open the cost is, because the chance of getting useful changes into firefox is next to nil unless you are part of the in crowd or pay them lots of money.

Also at least Opera is nice enough to pester you about the anti-phising stuff, unlike firefox which just sends all URLs you browse to off to google and others, firefox is becoming more like a trojan spying on its users and then phoning home with everything they do than a piece of useful software.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 96.237.136.240] on June 21, 2008 06:18 AM
Mayank, why did you say that you wish Opera were free? It already is, and has been so always. It used to be ad-supported a few years ago, but even that is no longer the case.

Also, with all due request, software doesn't become necessarily superior or better simply by being open source. In my experience, every successful open source application has needed a dedicated team of developers who make a huge bulk of the contribution, just like any successful proprietary software application. There isn't really that much difference as long as the software is engineered correctly and thus performs well.

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Mayank Sharma on June 21, 2008 02:33 PM
"Mayank, why did you say that you wish Opera were free? It already is, and has been so always. It used to be ad-supported a few years ago, but even that is no longer the case."

I meant free as in freedom to look at and modify the code. Free as in freedom, not beer.

"Also, with all due request, software doesn't become necessarily superior or better simply by being open source. In my experience, every successful open source application has needed a dedicated team of developers who make a huge bulk of the contribution, just like any successful proprietary software application. There isn't really that much difference as long as the software is engineered correctly and thus performs well."

True. Using free and open source software is just a personal preference. And to make sure I don't let that interfere with the review I mention it at the bottom, after what I believe is a fair assessment of a wonderful software.

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Re(1): Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 89.180.229.178] on June 22, 2008 09:48 PM
> I meant free as in freedom to look at and modify the code.

Actuall what you wrote was:

> If only it were free software and open source!

If by "free" you mean "open source", then what did you mean by "open source"...? :P

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 211.40.122.153] on June 21, 2008 06:27 AM
I love Opera, and I certainly think that it is the fastest, most fully featured browser; however, I don't like its setup. I don't like the way that the ctrl+F (find) feature works (firefox's is so much better). I like the bookmarks toolbar in Firefox. And I really like all the addons that are available for firefox. That being said, I like the way that Opera's ctrl+Tab functions better than Firefoxes (i.e. visiting the last tab rather than mindlessly cycling through). I also love the sidebar that opens up with one click. I even added it to firefox so that I had the same functionality (though with all these addons it does slow firefox down a little).

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 67.204.5.134] on June 21, 2008 07:07 AM
"I don't like the way that the ctrl+F (find) feature works (firefox's is so much better)"

I'm not a fan of the ctrl+F popup either, but there is an alternative: you can just press '/' followed by a pattern, and it will put a discrete box at the bottom of the screen, somewhat like firefox. The major difference being that it has no 'next' capability (it should work like 'n' in vim imo). However, if you then do ctrl+F, it will be prefilled with you last '/' search, so its more flexible than it seems. Opera has lots of useful keys like this, just check out their help files. (They turned it off by default now i believe, but the number row quick keys are amazing, e.g the 1 and 2 to go to left or right one tab.. etc)

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Re(1): Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 83.253.32.210] on June 21, 2008 09:05 AM
Actually there is "next" function for the quicksearch alternative ie for / or . (both bring up the quicksearch). To step to the next match the default is ctrl + g (quite sure you can rebind it to another key)

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Re(1): Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 84.190.65.192] on June 21, 2008 09:17 AM
> I'm not a fan of the ctrl+F popup either, but there is an alternative: you can just press
> '/' followed by a pattern, and it will put a discrete box at the bottom of the screen,
> somewhat like firefox. The major difference being that it has no 'next' capability
> (it should work like 'n' in vim imo)

No matter if you use the 'Ctrl+F' popup or the '/' inline search, just press F3 to get to the next match. Works like a charm. :)

For most users of Windows-based text editors, the F3 shorthand just comes naturally. :D

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.166.234.254] on June 21, 2008 11:15 AM
Try pressing the . (period) button. It gives you a search very similar to FFs

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 151.47.84.127] on June 21, 2008 06:29 AM
Opera has been my favorite browser for a couple of years now. After trying Firefox 3 one more time, I'm making the switch. It's not because I think FF is a better browser: Opera is sensibly faster, I like its GUI better, and has a few features (site preferences, to mention one) I like a lot and will miss.

Opera 9.50 is buggy on my Linux system, but this is not my main reason for switching. The reason is support. I've sent a few bug reports on the Opera forums, and the response from the developers was zero. And I don't like their community: my feeling is they are either fanboys or whiny kids who only complain about changes and bugs without constructive criticism.
If you read this forum you know what open source support is. I like it better.

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Re: If you read this forum you know what open source support is. I like it better.

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 125.168.48.19] on June 21, 2008 08:59 AM
Dunno what universe you are living in but there is plenty of VERY VERY old bugs listed against firefox the developers just plain ignore

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 66.130.39.107] on June 21, 2008 06:52 AM
"memory leaks that required me to reboot my PC twice a day to recover the lost memory"

WTF.

What os are you using ? Did you try killing firefox first ?

Maybe i didn't understand the joke :-)

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Re: What os are you using ? Did you try killing firefox first ?

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 125.168.48.19] on June 21, 2008 09:02 AM
The browser was requesting the memory then some how loosing it and killing/restarting firefox didn't regain it, I was one of the lucky 10% that seemed to be effected by this, in the beginning I thought it was just me then after a while there was such a loud roar of people all suffering from the same/similar problems, and to add insult to injury the developers just went and ignored anyone that said anything about memory leaks as not knowing what they were talking about, well funny last time I checked there has been what 300-400 memory leaks fixed?

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.18.81.138] on June 21, 2008 07:30 AM
The Total column for IE7 in the Javascript Engine Speed graph seems wrong. It's the slower browser in almost every test but the total bar is the shortest. How it can be?

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 220.47.251.83] on June 21, 2008 11:36 AM
I suspect the range was only limited and the bar went off the top and wrapped around ;)

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Mayank Sharma on June 21, 2008 02:29 PM
The total is NOT a simple addition of the other tests. Read the test page for details.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 121.45.225.236] on June 21, 2008 07:52 AM
I switch between the two quite routinely - I frankly don't care what browser I/you use, as long as it isn't IE :)

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.166.234.254] on June 21, 2008 11:18 AM
BTW, why does the comments use a flat view? The threaded view is much better! (change the url to render=threaded)

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 217.17.201.99] on June 21, 2008 12:30 PM
firefox can certainly be compiled to support more architectures than available for opera. i personally have firefox on mips, alpha, sparc, parisc, xscale, ppc and standard intel stuff. that's something opera doesn't do.

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Mobile web use needs the following features (in Free Software)

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.69.85.120] on June 21, 2008 01:06 PM
Mobile Web use needs the following basic features:
Calandar sync, Contact list sync, Bookmark sync, and Email sync (of course IMAP email already does that sync via IMAP server).

FireFox and Opera need to do the following:

Browsing - Like Opera FireFox needs a SYNC feature built-in so that if the user has Thunderbird that the user can use an existing IMAP email account to sych bookmarks to so that they are available on any computer (or Mozilla needs to host a server for bookmark sync, but really a feature for doing that using an email IMAP account would work just fine as with Thunderbird there is already an add-on from here that will sync contact info with an IMAP account - http://www.gargan.org/extensions/synckolab.html

EMAIL - Like the Thunderbird add-on above from http://www.gargan.org/extensions/synckolab.html (if they can get the calander working in Ubuntu's Thunderbird synckolab feature) this would be good to use with the Email offering from Opera too?

Of course - there might be other sync needs (but the above would cover the most bases for the most users)!

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Re: Mobile web use needs the following features (in Free Software)

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.69.85.120] on June 21, 2008 01:18 PM
If using via IMAP any Calandar sync, Contact list sync, Bookmark sync, and Email sync (of course IMAP email already does that sync via IMAP server).

Of course being able to have the sync encrypted so that all on the IMAP server is readable only by the "user client" would also be a good thing too.

AND extending that thought... Even having all or selected mail storage folders keep the mail that is auto encrypted when moved to that folder with IMAP would be a good thing no?

Any level of privacy from any wandering curiosity of server admins (who knows who they are or what their interests are etc), would be a good thing.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 129.242.225.59] on June 21, 2008 01:37 PM
Both / and . pops open the small quick-find, with F3 giving next. Now you only have to try hit F2, type both / and . and press Enter :)

One feature not mentioned was mouse-gestures, which I love. For example, I've bound Wand to a MouseDown,MouseUp gesture, which makes it very easy to login to any page. I have having to move my mouse to some button somewhere. MouseLeft and MouseRight (Back and Forward) also works very nice, with a very fast reload of the page. I've customized MouseUp to be a toggle for fullscreen view with the address bar visible on the bottom. Together with the Autosizer.js UserJS script this is very nice for watching image galleries.

Opera Link also synchronizes your personal bar (including your boomarklets) and notes, which makes it quite powerful and extremely useful for me that uses at least three different desktops a day. And you don't have to ever visit any opera web pages to sign up and start using it, just enter a username, password and email address from the "Synchronize Opera" dialogue, and you are good to go.

If you're a dev, Opera Dragonfly looks very nice - be sure to get the Debug Menu from the opera dragonfly blog as well.

To use TOR with Opera, just download the Vidalia bundle (or however you like to get TOR running on your machine), then go to preferences (CTRL+F12) -> Advanced -> Network to set up your proxies (default is 8118 if you use Vidalia, at least on Windows).

Another nice feature is that you can give you bookmarks a nick. Then just type the nick in the address bar and that's it. You can also give a nick to a bookmark folder, which will open up all links in that folder. And you can set that nick as your homepage, which will open up your chosen set of tabs each time you start Opera (instead of the more usual open up the last used tabs).

My number 1 reason I prefer Opera though is still the custom search feature. Right-click any serach field on any web page, and you can create a search and give it a shortcut. This shortcut works on the address bar, for instance the default "g sexy linux" will search google for the terms 'sexy' and 'linux'. But now you can also search your regional online phone book, the imdb database, a list apart articles, whatever. I find that most times I start a browser, I want to go to some web page to do a search. I love not having to go to the webpage first. And to to the address bar, F8 will focus the address bar of your current tab (yes, in Opera, the address bar is logically positioned beneath the tabs :), while F2 will popup a blank address bar dialogue.

I still use Firefox almost daily, for the StumbleUpon extension :) Maybe we'll see docking and web-site interaction from widgets in some distant future of Opera.

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 71.58.60.61] on June 22, 2008 08:27 PM
You can give search shortcuts like that in Firefox too; it's had that feature since at least version 2. Right click a search box and click 'Add a keyword for this search'.

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 194.78.167.110] on July 02, 2008 10:37 AM
Try http://www.operastumbler.com/ for your opera stumbling needs :)

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 201.172.126.251] on June 21, 2008 02:41 PM
The most important and common action I take with my browser is saving pictures. I collect them, I have millions (and none are porn, thank you). Opera still kicks ass as the fastest photo downloader. It saves them i-n-s-t-a-n-t-l-y, whereas in FF the same actions is delayed, sometimes seconds. Opera even lets you save pictures in pages that are somehow "protected", FF just displays whatever error mssg the webmaster wants to give you like "This picture is copyrighted".

This new FF still has the dumb ass default as the prev version: It doesn't display tabs when there's only one page open, it downloads directly to God-knows-where instead of asking where yo save every file, it shrinks pictures to fit in the page (which is slower), and so on.

I use both, but Opera about 95% of the time.

#

Re: Firefox Tab features...

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.14.219.135] on June 22, 2008 09:01 AM
ALL of the issues which people have mentioned about tabs in FF (bad navigation, losing the bar when only one page is open) are easily solved by combining Gary's "Tab Mix Plus" extension with FireGestures. TMP lets you specify all the hotkey actions, context menu options, and mouse click actions; Firegestures does the gestures.

As for bloat-- one man's bloat is another's necessity! I love my "heavyweight" browser. Anyway, there's another 400 extensions I'm NOT using, I haven't porked it up THAT badly. At least, not yet! (joke)

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 64.126.139.32] on June 21, 2008 03:03 PM
I use both, but I am in Opera 90%+ of the time. Besides just having used it for a few years and now being used to it, there is less set up time and I'm happier with it right out of the box. Firefox and Opera can do nearly the exact same things, but I have to find, download, install, and maintain 15+ plugins to get firefox to do the same thing.

I would MUCH rather that Opera were free (as in freedom) but the arguement that "you can't be sure that this propietary software will remain updated and free(as in beer)" is lame. I can't count on ANYTHING to be continously update and available. Sure, I could download the code and maintain it myself, but I'm to busy using my computer for my own tasks, thanks. Firefox plugins will routinely stop working after large updates until someone fixes the plugin, which does not always happen. Also, at 10+, it gets to the point that I have to update FF nearly every day to stay on top of them.

Opera just does what I want it to do right away and still has the ability to use plugins (widgets). I still haven't forgiven FF for being such rediculous asses about the memory leaks. In the same day you could read posts about the "leaks" being "caching features" and read the beta announcment for FF3 where they explain how they fixed 300+ memory leaks. The balls. The only time I open firefox up is if some site just doesn't render right in opera (about 0.01% of random sites) or the site is coding to block Opera explictly. (Two sites I freqent)

The speed differences between the two are completely negligable (I sure as hell can't tell) everywhere except for one spot. Opening old tabs. I will often have 30+ tabs in a saved session. Opera doesn't think for a moment about loading them, FF3 still has a cow. A 5 second difference in start up time isn't all that meaningful to me though, it's a microscopic fraction to the amount of time I have it open.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.156.88.143] on June 21, 2008 03:15 PM
I have been using Opera for the last year and it has become my browser of choice. FF was too slow and cumbersome on my old P2 and even on the big box, it would seem to take forever to boot, whereas Opera was there. Some of the changes in Opera 9.5 have taken some getting used to, but overall I am still happy with the changes. I have a couple of websites that are difficult to access, but if I come into the page I want through Google or a bookmark rather than from their homepage, it all works. My only continuing beef is with opening gmail and I found a fix for that.

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 195.205.193.228] on June 26, 2008 06:50 AM
Sadly Opera 9.5 is slower than Firefox, not in terms of opening pages but in terms of site updating from cache.
I use the the i-google feature with widgets, while Firefox already showed updated Opera showed the old widgets.
That is a big issue for me....

#

Re(1): Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 195.205.193.228] on June 26, 2008 06:54 AM
On the other side: there are pages, that eat Firefox to breakfast (over 1Gb RAM usage in 20 minutes ), clearly a flaw in the website, that put Firefox on it's knees
IE, and Opera don't suffer from that issue (the same site Opera and IE about 50 Mb of RAM usage)

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: DylanMcCall on June 21, 2008 03:22 PM
Sounds to me like Opera is loaded comes with a lot of bloat that is completely out of scope for a web browser. I do not see how this is a good thing. It may not interfere with performance, but I for one do not like it when a computer program such as a web browser starts acting like an operating system.
Maybe it's just me, though. Are these actually separate extensions just described as if they are part of core? Do they come installed and enabled by default?

That said, they've really cleaned up the interface here. Neat!


Anonymous person talking about search keywords: Firefox has that same feature, implemented in the same way. It is poorly done in either browser because one must memorize keywords. Epiphany does this fairly well by having search bookmarks appear on the address bar, so if I type something in that bar I get the option to search for it listed below. No memory required.
Unfortunately, Epiphany seems to be broken for me following the move to XULRunner, so I'm with Firefox for the next six months...

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 41.177.19.214] on June 21, 2008 04:25 PM
"Sounds to me like Opera is loaded comes with a lot of bloat that is completely out of scope for a web browser."

And yet its performance and memory usage is on par (if not better) than "leaner" browsers, despite packing a lot more features.

Also - no, it's features are not completely out of the scope of a web browser. They all relate very specifically to web related tasks.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 72.68.227.212] on June 21, 2008 04:03 PM
Personally, I don't like Opera because its widgets don't integrate with the browser on the same level as do Firefox extensions. Also:
*Opera is proprietary
*Without a functional extensions analog, it looks like the Opera devs assume that what they like, I like (a la Mac/Apple)
*Sure Opera matched Fx feature for feature, but did they match NoScript? It's not like anyone can make a widget for that, since widgets don't integrate that well...
*Why go to the trouble of installing Opera and then deciding I don't like it (I did this) when Fx is installed by default on Ubuntu?

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 87.121.96.142] on June 21, 2008 06:27 PM
"*Why go to the trouble of installing Opera and then deciding I don't like it (I did this) when Fx is installed by default on Ubuntu?"

Then let's all use IE, beacuse it's installed by default in Windows...

#

Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 210.49.36.61] on June 22, 2008 06:17 AM
"Why go to the trouble of installing Opera and then deciding I don't like it (I did this) when Fx is installed by default on Ubuntu?"

That's the same reason people are still using Internet Explorer on Windows.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 64.46.1.9] on June 21, 2008 07:38 PM
I've been using Opera for years. I've always had Firefox/Seamonkey installed as well and I keep coming back because Opera is simply better.
For those of you still hung up on the "open-source/free" issue. Let me put these two points to you:
- If open-source is so good, how come it didn't produce the clearly better browser (in terms of functionality)?
- Do most browser users care that they can modify the source code? As far as most are concerned whether it's a company doing the modification, or some band of unknown strangers, it matters not. Primarily because most users ARE NOT PROGRAMMERS. You're free to modify and fix your car. How many people do that?

Get over it, Opera is a great browser (I personally think it's the best) and it is more cross-platform than Firefox. I wouldn't care if it was "free" or made by Microsoft.

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 82.192.250.149] on June 22, 2008 09:25 AM
"- Do most browser users care that they can modify the source code? As far as most are concerned whether it's a company doing the modification, or some band of unknown strangers, it matters not. Primarily because most users ARE NOT PROGRAMMERS. You're free to modify and fix your car. How many people do that?"

The benefits of freedom are not just "can modify the source code". Here are some others:

1. If the company behind some proprietary software goes out of business, the codebase can effectively disappear. After a while, no upgrades. no fixes, etc. No ports to other architectures. (Intel x86 will not be the only big-selling architecture forever).

2. If there's a bug or a support issue with proprietary software, only one company can fix it because only they have the source. With free software, there are lots of companies (mostly small) which can support it.

3. With free software, you can be sure - by rebuilding from reviewed source - that there are no trapdoors or other hidden nasties present. With proprietary software, the best you can ever say is that you don't know of any.

#

Re(1): Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 195.205.193.228] on July 03, 2008 10:56 AM
"1. If the company behind some proprietary software goes out of business, the codebase can effectively disappear. After a while, no upgrades. no fixes, etc. No ports to other architectures. (Intel x86 will not be the only big-selling architecture forever)."

That's not a problem - you simply switch to another »better« browser. Basicaly every browser has the same layout, the difference lies in add-ons and aditional features, that are not always useful. Talking about Firefox it's worse than Windows. How? Both have some options easily available and both have way more hidden options (registry in windows, and the »about:config« page). Why is it impossible to change the amount of simultaneously downloaded files in a options window? Why do I have to search some cryptic names at the about:config page?

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 70.17.78.226] on June 21, 2008 07:55 PM
When I used to use Windows, I was a Firefox fanboy. One of my friends told me to try Opera for a day. I was hooked. It was fast, adapted to my Windows themes, had a shitload of features, and just felt more ergonomic. When I made the switch to Linux, I just used Firefox because many of the major distros liked Firefox. I am using Firefox 3 right now, but I am planning on switching back to Opera. If Opera can find some way to inherit your icon theme _and_ your Gnome theme, I would switch immediately.

Many small distros and LiveCD distributions include Opera because of its low memory footprint and its multitude of features.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 88.228.146.219] on June 21, 2008 09:51 PM
Opera 9.5 also passes the ACID 2 test?
http://etki-alani.blogspot.com my bloglog.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.53.24.104] on June 22, 2008 01:02 AM
After using Mozilla, Firebird, Firefox for years, I eagerly dowloaded Firefox3 on dowload day to give my little contribution and help break the record. I installed it in my Mandriva but I could not use it. It told me I needed new GTK and Glib libraries. What a Disappointment ! What a Mess !! I decided then to try the new Opera 9.5 .It installed in seconds and worked like a clock. What a nice surprise ! Fast "little" browser !!
I just don't have the time nor the inspiration to spend a day to upgrade my Mandriva 2006 to something newer just to use a new browser. I guess from now on I'll stick to Opera. Thanks Opera.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 72.201.255.127] on June 22, 2008 02:32 AM
I'm surpised no one has mentioned the feature to quickly add new sites to the search bar... I love that feature!

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 72.201.255.127] on June 22, 2008 02:34 AM
You just right click the search bar on any website and click "create search"! BTW I love the new theme! To the person who mentioned they didn't like it?!

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 208.120.3.234] on June 22, 2008 04:57 AM
My only problem with Opera is that I cannot copy photos to send to my friends. Just does not work. Text works but photos don't. If they could do that I would probably switch to Opera. Until then, I will stick with Firefox.

#

Opera 9.5--Mouse gestures

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 67.193.241.59] on June 22, 2008 04:59 AM
I see no mention of the feature, I found most useful in Opera Mouse gestures. very useful if want doing a lot of browsing (reading news site)...

#

Opera for the SVG!

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 98.160.152.216] on June 22, 2008 06:03 AM
Scalable Vector Graphics - Opera follows the standard & it works,
all others are pretenders pushing proprietary bit mapped crap.

#

Mouse gestures are GREAT, but both Opera and FF have them.

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 75.14.219.135] on June 22, 2008 08:43 AM
'Firegestures' provides the same 'mouse gestures' functionality in Firefox, and I agree with the Opera fans: closing, navigating, and opening gazillions of tabs is sure a lot nicer with gestures than it is in the "standard" way, crawling around a menu for a second click, or moving your mouse all the way up to the tab bar to do an operation.

Opera displays many "written for IE" garbage-laden pages better than Firefox "quirks mode", sometimes I have to switch browsers for that reason. I don't understand the author's fascination with 'speed dial' -- in FF3, you can set your "home page" as a group of bookmarks, and use gestures to rapidly SEE the contents and close the ones you don't want. The 'speed dial' thumbnails, though large, are still too small to really see what the content is :(

Firefox is just as tight with "real estate" as Opera -- all you need to do is download a 'minimalist theme', such as "classic compact" (which I use, it's VERY tight). And that's the key advantage with Firefox-- you don't just settle for a few plugins, you've got over 400 add-ons to choose from. Many of them are nearly indespensable for cleaning garbage and "noisy" ads of the Internet: Adblock (with the optional element hiding helper add-on), flashblock, RIP, and of course, the greatest of all: Greasemonkey. View the web as YOU like it!

BTW, I also have Konqueror (and don't like it). FF3 and Opera 9.5 are my two preferences, but when you customize FF3, it seems WAY better. And also-- already, after barely a week, the current test builds for FF 3.1 have already added another 5 'passed' tests on ACID3. I have a few bits of userchrome.css to make some menus prettier, it's easy to do when you can look at the source code online without even checking it out. And here's my add-ons:

[b]Generated:[/b] Sun Jun 22 2008 00:33:36 GMT-0700 (PDT)
[b]User Agent:[/b] Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9) Gecko/2008052912 Firefox/3.0
[b]Build ID:[/b] 2008052912

[b]Enabled Extensions:[/b] [49]
- [url=http://www.google.com/search?q=Firefox%20about%3Asafebrowsing]about:safebrowsing[/url] 1.0
- [url=http://adblockplus.org/]Adblock Plus[/url] 0.7.5.5
- [url=http://adblockplus.org/]Adblock Plus: Element Hiding Helper[/url] 1.0.5
- [url=http://autoformer.mozdev.org/]AutoFormer[/url] 0.4.1.5
- [url=http://blog.environmentalchemistry.com/2008/03/firefox-theme-classic-compact.html]Classic Compact Options[/url] 1.1.2
- [url=http://customsoftwareconsult.com/extensions]CLEO[/url] 3.3.1
- [url=http://binaryturf.com/]ColorfulTabs[/url] 3.1
- [url=http://www.blackbirdblog.it/progetti/connect-to-address]Connect to address[/url] 1.1.7
- [url=http://console2.mozdev.org/index.html]Console²[/url] 0.3.9.2
- [url=http://www.customizegoogle.com/]CustomizeGoogle[/url] 0.72
- [url=http://downloadstatusbar.mozdev.org/]Download Statusbar[/url] 0.9.6.3
- [url=http://ted.mielczarek.org/code/mozilla/extensiondev/]Extension Developer[/url] 0.3.0.20080526
- [url=http://customsoftwareconsult.com/extensions]FEBE[/url] 5.3.1
- [url=http://firefly.mozdev.org/]Firefly[/url] 0.3.3
- [url=http://www.xuldev.org/firegestures/]FireGestures[/url] 1.1.2
- [url=http://flashblock.mozdev.org/]Flashblock[/url] 1.5.6
- [url=http://forecastfox.mozdev.org/]Forecastfox[/url] 0.9.7.6
- [url=http://www.botsko.net]Form Saver[/url] 0.7
- [url=http://www.greasespot.net/]Greasemonkey[/url] 0.8.20080609.0
- [url=http://users.skynet.be/mgueury/mozilla/]Html Validator[/url] 0.8.4.0
- [url=http://www.hacksrus.com/~ginda/venkman/]JavaScript Debugger[/url] 0.9.87.4
- [url=http://forum.softwareblaze.com]JSView[/url] 2.0.4
- [url=http://yellow5.us/firefox/linkification/]Linkification[/url] 1.3.3
- [url=http://quality.mozilla.org/]Mozilla Quality Extension[/url] 0.1.5
- [url=http://www.mrtech.com/extensions/]MR Tech Toolkit (formerly Local Install)[/url] 6.0.1
- [url=http://www.oxymoronical.com/web/firefox/nightly]Nightly Tester Tools[/url] 2.0.2
- [url=http://www.google.com/search?q=Firefox%20Nuke%20Anything%20Enhanced]Nuke Anything Enhanced[/url] 0.68.1
- [url=http://openaddons.extra.hu]Open Addons[/url] 1.0.5
- [url=http://space.geocities.yahoo.co.jp/gl/alice0775]PatchForLibrary[/url] 4.1
- [url=http://platypus.mozdev.org]Platypus[/url] 0.80
- [url=http://quickjavaplugin.blogspot.com/]QuickJava[/url] 0.4.2.1
- [url=http://redirectremover.mozdev.org]Redirect Remover[/url] 2.5.5
- [url=http://rip.mozdev.org/]Remove It Permanently[/url] 1.0.6.4
- [url=http://rickardandersson.com/]Right-Click-Link[/url] 1.1.3
- [url=http://www.nu22.com/firefox/rssvalidator]RSS Validator[/url] 0.3.2
- [url=http://sage.blat.co.za]Sage-Too[/url] 1.0.0
- [url=http://andy.5263.org/screengrab/]Screen grab![/url] 0.95
- [url=http://ff.seoquake.com/]SeoQuake[/url] 2.1.4
- [url=http://v2studio.com/k/moz/]Stop-or-Reload Button[/url] 0.2.2
- [url=http://tmp.garyr.net]Tab Mix Plus[/url] 0.3.6.1.080416
- [url=http://www.cfavatar.com/textComplete.cfm]Text Complete[/url] 0.9.9.4
- [url=http://tinderstatus.mozdev.org/]Tinderstatus[/url] 0.2.9
- [url=http://codefisher.org/toolbar_button/]Toolbar Buttons[/url] 0.5.0.5
- [url=http://www.totalvalidator.com/tool/extension.html]Total Validator[/url] 5.2
- [url=http://chrispederick.com/work/user-agent-switcher/]User Agent Switcher[/url] 0.6.11
- [url=http://mozilla.queze.net]View Dependencies[/url] 0.3.3.0
- [url=http://mozilla.queze.net/]View Frames[/url] 1.0
- [url=http://chrispederick.com/work/web-developer/]Web Developer[/url] 1.1.6
- [url=http://www.google.com/search?q=Firefox%20YesScript]YesScript[/url] 1.3

[b]Disabled Extensions:[/b] [1]
- [url=http://dbaron.org/mozilla/leak-monitor/]Leak Monitor[/url] 0.4.2

[b]Total Extensions: 50[/b]

[b]Installed Themes:[/b] [4]
- [b][url=http://blog.environmentalchemistry.com/2008/03/firefox-theme-classic-compact.html]Classic Compact[/url] 3.0.8[/b]
- [url=http://www.mozilla.org/]Default[/url]
- [url=http://www.geocities.com/alfredkayser/mozilla/littlemozilla.htm]LittleFox[/url] 1.8.33
- [url=http://www.geocities.com/alfredkayser/mozilla/walnut.htm]Walnut for Firefox[/url] 1.8.33

[b]Installed Plugins:[/b] (3)
- Default Plugin
- Java(TM) Plug-in 1.6.0_05-b13
- Shockwave Flash

Obviously, the Author tested a TOTALLY different browser than I'm using. (No gestures, no tab groups, no adblocks [I have thousands, mostly by subscription], no Greasemonkey scripts, and the really ugly default theme.) No wonder he wasn't impressed!

#

Re: Mouse gestures are GREAT, but both Opera and FF have them.

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 89.137.126.4] on June 23, 2008 09:41 PM
Greasemonkey scripts work in opera. Actually you can do a lot more in opera then with greasemonkey because you have the ability to modify the page while its loading

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 59.178.37.68] on June 22, 2008 11:09 AM
Some people would just look for a reason to crib. I'm amazed to see that many of these open source supporters are actually 'Firefox Fanboys' and they defend Firefox exactly like a Macboy would defend Safari. :D

In any case, I bought my PC just an year ago but i've been browsing via phones for a couple of years now. That's one department where Firefox doesn't exist and Opera rules the game. On PC, I may not have a specific preference for any browser and I have all three (Opera, Firefox and IE) but whenever I browse I end up using Opera most of the times. The innovative ideas like Speed Dial, IRC and over the air Bookmark Sync between all devices is just too good.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 24.205.112.226] on June 22, 2008 11:17 AM
I run Linux. On the one remaining XP box I own I have loaded for the person that uses it as many open source alternatives as I can. I wave the Open Source flag on as many fronts as I can but Firefox (no matter what the fan boys say) has been going down hill since 0.9 in the one place I really require a browser to operate...BROWSING. I've spent the last several years watching Firefox go from a fast, low overhead speed demon of a browser to a slow, buggy resource intensive POS. FF2 consistently went into a total lockup on any Flash content I would access. FF3 Beta was a definite improvement. Instead of going into a total lock requiring "killall" it was kind enough just to kill itself, requiring a restart, on only MOST Flash content. FF3 has decided to crash, randomly, on ANY page it sees fit. Well, all hail the returning champion!

And don't blame the Flash problems on Adobe. Funny, Flash runs great in Opera under Linux.

Open Source is fantastic, and I'm a complete supporter BUT first and foremost I want my damned machine to perform when I sit down in front of it. Therefore it's going to be Opera for me.

And the sad part is that FF2 and 3 have run flawlessly on the Windows version, but the Linux version? Not so much. I'm tired of the crap. I'm not apologizing for Firefox anymore, I'm through. FF supports open source? Hardly. If an open source developer isn't supporting the very community that first embraced it and helped to build it, why all the evangelism on their part? Opera works. And at the end of the day, isn't that the most important consideration?

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.186.13.240] on June 22, 2008 12:40 PM
Opera has a much much better feel.
I applaud all open source projects, I've contributed code myself, however I'm not going for FF just cause it's open.
Regarding the copying, I don't really care, please everyone copy each other, get the good features in.

#

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.110.110.172] on June 22, 2008 02:54 PM

Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 91.140.47.254] on June 22, 2008 06:14 PM
Did someone mention Greasemonkey?
I am an opera user and when I wanted to try out a greasemonkey script I thought "crap, I have to run Firefox AND add another plugin..."
But then I found out that Opera supports user javascript, therefore most greasemonkey scripts will just work.
I've been using Opera for ages and I'm still impressed by the "Oh that new feature? Yeah, we had that built-in like, 2 versions ago" attitude.
And I still remember my reaction when I first decided to try firefox: "Why does it take so long to switch tabs?"-"Why do I press 2 keys where 1 would do?"-"Why do i have to wait ANY time to go back?"-"Why is it so sluggish with just 25 tabs open?"

Maybe I'll give Firefox 3 a shot, but I'm guessing I'll have more or less the same gripes...

#

opera no longer in the lead?

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 74.95.113.201] on June 23, 2008 12:15 AM
I used Opera 8 for a few years, from the time firefox was named "firebird" until firefox 2.0.X. I wanted to like Firefox, but it just had so many problems it was unusable... it leaked memory like crazy, crashed all the time, could never restore a session after quitting or crashing, and all the extensions and preferences broke after each upgrade.

In sharp contrast, Opera 8 was small, fast, and reliable. Sure, it was less customizable and lacked some features I wanted, but it was solid. I could have 150 tabs open and not worry about losing them. It never ate all my memory or lost my session data, and after changing almost every setting and editing a bunch of config files, I managed to get it configured to an acceptable state.

But I've switched back to Firefox, for several reasons:

- Opera doesn't run on some of the architectures I need to use.
- Opera 9 runs incredibly slowly on every system I've tried it on. Actions like scrolling a page or moving the text cursor respond so slowly that I get distracted by the time the browser catches up.
- Opera 9 seems to get exponentially slower as more tabs are opened.
- Since Opera 9 was unusable for me, I stuck with Opera 8... but that just increased friction more and more over time, with no updates and ever-increasing pressure to switch.
- Opera 8 is missing some important features, like ad blocking and smooth scrolling.
- I've found several bugs in Opera, and filed them, but there has never been any response, and none have been fixed.
- Opera has some annoying misfeatures, like raising itself on every mouse click, instead of letting the window manager handle that sort of thing. Its zoom feature insists on scaling images (with no interpolation). And, it breaks copy/paste from remote displays.
- Opera's mail client and other built-in non-browser apps are annoying and can't be removed.
- Opera doesn't work with some sites I need to use.

And, the biggest reason: Firefox fixed its memory and reliability issues, and has greatly improved its handling of extensions. So, now it's on par with Opera for reliability, and way ahead in terms of features and flexibility.

One other thing I didn't list is Opera's proprietary nature. Some would say that being open-source is not a valid feature, but it would at least allow me to fix the things which bother me. I could use the source to locate bugs or fix bugs, not to mention turning annoying features off.

Also, a common complaint about Firefox is that the user must install extra themes or extensions to make it work nicely, where Opera comes with all the right stuff by default. But I've found that Opera's defaults are annoying and configuring it took over a week of research and fiddling. Setting up Firefox from scratch takes me just a few minutes, mostly spent browsing through extensions to decide what I want.

As far as I can tell, Opera was ahead, but it has lost its lead.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 203.184.56.243] on June 23, 2008 12:26 AM
Re: "If only it [opera] were free software and open source!"
Are you kidding? I have to say Opera is faster, stabler, more platform independant and has a better UI than any other browser. Why? because it has dedicated developers focusing 100% on it that have a very real (financial) incentive to get it right and listen to their users. You have to ask the question - why do Open Source developers donate their time? Of course it varies, but once averaged, you will find that user satisfaction is not as high a priority as the developer's satisfaction, and thus the user experience will always be inferior.

If Opera was open source, it would not be as good as it is.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 58.104.14.233] on June 23, 2008 02:57 AM
Excuse the blunt langauge, but Opera shits all over Firefox as much as Firefox shits all over IE. To say it "gives Firefox a run for its money" is an understatement at best.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 76.171.185.195] on June 23, 2008 06:46 AM
Mayank,

Thanks for the article and getting this huge discussion going. I enjoyed the reading all the comments about Opera vs Firefox. I have always been a huge fan of firefox and never used Opera. Looking at this article and comments, I'm very interested in checking out Opera.

Ramesh
<a href="http://www.thegeekstuff.com">The Geek Stuff</a>


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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 203.123.181.228] on June 23, 2008 07:52 AM
Opera Rocks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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My favorite (killer) Opera feature

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 10.100.209.150] on June 23, 2008 10:25 AM
Z and X (as in page back/forward).
It's unfortunately not enabled as default anymore in 9.50 but can be restored through the preferences.
Yes I know FF/IE has backspace (and FF has plugins for keybindings) but reaching for it (with either hand) is unnecessery movement.

Z/X are where my right hand is anyway so it's fast (worlds fastest browser, hmmm...) to use and ergonomical as well.

- Peder

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 72.211.175.87] on June 24, 2008 12:01 AM
Even with FireGestures, Firefox's mouse gesture abilities aren't equal to those of Opera. Open both. Find a photo gallery on the web. Go to the first image. It's a nice image so you want to go to the next one in the gallery. All Opera needs is a flick to the right, because it remembers all the image links on the previous page and will take you to the next image without having to go back to the main gallery and select the second image.

I only started using Opera with the 9.5 alpha builds (previously a Firefox user), but I've come to prefer Opera.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 63.227.104.31] on June 24, 2008 06:01 AM
Wow, this article is just a little bit biased don't you think? They're both good browsers, both fast, and ignoring my own personal preference, (opera) I'd just like to say that this article is definitely not giving firefox a fair review.

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Firefox User

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 85.217.192.66] on June 24, 2008 12:49 PM
i`m firefox user since 2003, but now i`m using opera.
1. the stupid servers failure while the stupid download world record idea
2. i`m bulgarian, and the official firefox page even now is telling me "download firefox 3.0 bulgarian", and still(one week!) gives me Not Found
The requested URL /pub/mozilla.org/firefox/releases/3.0/win32/bg/Firefox Setup 3.0.exe was not found on this server.

well, i`m not sucker.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 129.241.139.145] on June 24, 2008 12:51 PM
One of the best things whit Opera is how efient the browsing is. It's easy to brows fast whit out the mouse.
use ',' to seach for links and "Enter" to go to the page "Backspace" to go back "Shift and Arrows" to navigate elements on the page. Use '.' to seach in pages. ctrl+Enter to login to a page whit wand. ctrl+Tab to cycle tabs.

Whit the mouse you "rigth click" and mouse wheel to cycle tabs. and to log inn to pages whit and simply hold right mouse button an a short move to the right. and u are inn. Loginn pages are gone form the screen in 1s.

Not haveing this in FF makes me feel like i have lost my arm.

Startup in Opera is allso wery fast whit allot of tabs and feeds. I usaly have Opera running all day long. putting it in the tray whit ctrl + h (leaves widgets operational).

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 41.247.67.68] on June 24, 2008 12:52 PM
You say 'if only it were free and open source'. It is free. It's not open source.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 83.59.39.84] on June 24, 2008 02:31 PM
Firefox is a nice browser, but is overhyped and overrated. Opera 9.5 does what I want without having to hunt for two dozens extensions, it's still faster than Firefox, and is actually more standards compliant, so is my browser of choice.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 170.135.240.12] on June 24, 2008 02:35 PM
Opera strongly supports *open standards* for the web. At SXSW conference, the "browser wars" panel moderator even joked that everytime Opera introduces anything, they strive to work with other vendors to standardize it. Fact is, they advocate an open web based on standards so that each vendor/maker can compete on the merits of the browser.

As for Open Source code, I'll echo all thoughts mentioned here, but add my confusion on the whole "what if the company goes out of business..." argument I've seen several times here. My response is: so what? I understand a Word processor, or music player, or any software package where your data needs to be retrieved for later. But I think that argument holds *much less* water when dealing with web content. As long as the web standards are upheld (see above), then what difference does it make if Opera doesn't exist tomorrow? I'm not going to be denied viewing the same web pages I was yesterday. Opera has bookmarks, contacts and "notes" which can all be exported or emailed.

So if Opera stops existing tomorrow, I fireup my firefox install (my second favorite browser) and browse away. But today, they offer the best experience and the least headaches for me.

-Eddie

*That said, I'm not advocating against Open Source, I would like Opera to do so. I just think Open STANDARDS are much more important... and so does Opera.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 172.20.43.7] on June 24, 2008 03:49 PM
no adblock? no extension-for-every-purpose-i-can-think-of? no deal! ;)

a little more verbose: i don't care if another browser is "faster" as long as firefox isn't "slow", i care for the features the browser (with plugins/extensions/whatever) offers. I even suffer through the fugly GTK dialogs while using FF on KDE because i just like my extensions.

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Sigh!

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 216.232.22.122] on June 24, 2008 07:01 PM
With all these features, Opera should be number 1 used browser where it got the chance against Internet Explorer. Oh wait, it isn't. Other than that, this article is just flamebait.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 213.168.120.253] on June 24, 2008 09:40 PM
I recently saw a poll with about 3000 participants. Over 80% that used Opera for more than 3 months, never went back to another browser!!!
Something to think about!

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 24.210.232.75] on June 25, 2008 01:45 AM
Opera 9.5 was extremely fast and works very well with both XP and Linus. Thanks.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 190.57.99.84] on June 25, 2008 04:20 AM
Even if Opera it's not open source, I can't deny it just works better than FF3 (at least for me :P ). Opera has a lot o little details that putting all together makes a really better experience surfing on the internet.

My only complain (already reported as a bug) is that when sometimes when I am downloading big files (around the 100 MB) it just get freeze, nevertheless the download still works (thanks good for that) so I have no option but to restart the browser once it has finished the download. I dont know why it is, but maybe it happends due to I actualiced from 9.23 version, so Im going to try to install it from zero, just to see if it works.

Does anyone of you have had the same problem???

Even still, Opera keeps rocking!!!

Saludos desde Guatemala.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 218.185.78.100] on June 25, 2008 04:31 AM
The problem downloading a big file in Opera 9.5 (which I've not found even going up to 500MB+) could be related to the GDI leak in the transfer window which is fixed in the first post 9.5 weekly build.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 218.185.78.100] on June 25, 2008 04:32 AM
Hmm. The site seems to have eaten some of my posts... shame.

Only one I can remember was that if you use stumbleupon, you can use http://www.operastumbler.com/ in Opera. It works reasonably well.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 218.185.78.100] on June 25, 2008 04:33 AM
One comment was to the person talking about Opera 8 and Opera 9 and complaining that they did not have features they want or were slow.

Opera 8 came out over 4 years ago
Opera 9 came out over 2 years ago
Opera 9.5 came out a month back.

Might be time to sing a new tune?

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 218.185.78.100] on June 25, 2008 08:05 AM
One thing that the last line in this article rekindled in me is a real pissed off streak that Stallman managed to subvert a word of the English language as in 'free software' to something other than what it means, such that that last line can even be said in all seriousness and not mean "without monetary cost".

Naff. Open source fine. Free software not.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 68.33.155.63] on June 25, 2008 09:23 AM
Windows only, I use IE7+iePro, Opera, and FF3. I like the features that iePro has given IE7, but rendering speed of Opera has me using it more and more. I've never been a fan of Mozilla since they released the code and I saw the original Navigator code monstrosity. Opera 9.5 was a free download and is working great. The only problem I've seen is it's locked up on me once while using Google's Street-view feature of their maps. Also, FF3 does not render poorly coded websites as well as Opera or IE7.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 10.10.22.57] on June 26, 2008 03:20 PM
you could test trunk version too (or beta for opera browser)
I test myself Firefox 3.0 vs Swiftweasel (Firefox w/o proprietary parts and compiled for different types of series of processors old amd/p3/p4 etc..)
in my test the swiftweasel was faster by 5.6% than normal firefox (it has the same functions etc.. I use lot of addons and it didn't break any one of them)

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 83.15.109.194] on June 26, 2008 11:13 PM
In Opera 9.5 you can do something like tags - just put keywords into description of bookmark. Next time, when you write tag in address bar, described page will be shown to you.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 83.7.155.127] on June 27, 2008 05:51 PM
"If only it were free software"

Opera is FREE - no charge. Closed source. I like it.

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Re: Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Joe Barr on June 27, 2008 05:59 PM
<insert explanation free-as-in-beer v free-as-in-speech>

Free software is not the same thing as freeware. The delta is large. People like it.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 76.190.235.199] on June 28, 2008 08:38 PM
And give a look-up of Opera, Firefox and IE on secunia.com. See for yourself which one is the best in security. This is why I love and stick with Opera; the first and the best concerning tabbed browsing as well.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 212.43.15.1] on June 30, 2008 10:24 PM
I have added a new post to my blog about Opera vs. FF, which talks about the anti-phishing capabilities of both of them. enjoy :)

"The war is still burning between Opera Vs FF, and they have improved the code to secure the user’s online life. As working with security products as a daily basis task, I have the habit of testing their capabilities to approve what they are suppose to protect against. Sometimes when you put anything to the test, you’ll get surprising results and mostly disappointing. Today, I got two contenders, Opera 9 and Firefox 3."


Continue Reading ...

http://extremesecurity.blogspot.com/2008/06/firefox-vs-opera-anti-phishing-review_30.html

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 194.78.167.110] on July 02, 2008 11:00 AM
I don't really understand people shouting "it's notopensource". Yes I like opensource software and use it every day, but I don't think opensource should become a religion like it seems to be for a lot of ppl, even if they claim it isn't one. Most of the people shouting this never contributed to any opensource project, or even looked at the code. I do contribute to a few opensource (GPLv2) projects That's the 1st thing.

2nd thing is, for me as a user the most important thing is not opensource - it is choice, competition and open standard support. I can choose the best browser, and Opera made it clear in the last 9 years I use it (yes - since 3.x) that they commit themselfs to their users and open standards, for example the entire original CSS spec was designed by ppl at Opera. Opera has introduced about any innovative feature which is so loved in FF by it's users - like tabs for example, but if only FF would copy it better...

Sure I tried Firefox 1, 2 and now 3, but it just feels to basic and limited for me without tons of extentions installed - which on every upgrade have a rather high chance to break. I don't feel like looking for new extentions all the time when installing a new version, or looking for an alternative because the old-one isn't supported anymore. Compared to that - I didn't reconfigure my opera since I did a clean Opera 8.0 reinstall... If FF would ever become better (in usability terms) than Opera (I doubt it) I would use it, but as it currently stands, I'll stick with Opera. I simply don't understand that the FF team can't see that they lack basic functionality. Everyone who is a bit of a powerusers installs tons of extentions to provide very basic usability features which should be in-there by default. Only 1 of those usability improvements made it into v3: session saving, but that sure took a while...

The speed of a browser doesn't really matter for me I think, as long as it is responsive and not horribly slow - it's ok. Usability and open standard support are my primary concern.

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 62.215.148.129] on July 04, 2008 03:09 PM
Could you run a Mac OSX 10.5 test as well with Firefox as well as Opera, since you included windows Id like to see the Mac numbers on the board as well.

Thanks

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Opera 9.5 gives Firefox 3 a run for its money

Posted by: Anonymous [ip: 74.196.167.148] on July 10, 2008 07:20 AM
One thing not mentioned yet is that Firefox uses a bunch of modals. I hates them. Go to Tools->Dowloads and you get a new window which takes up space on my crowded taskbar. Transfers in Opera is a tab or pops out of the left side.

The irc stuff for firefox is near worthless. After cursory searching it seemed like Chatzilla was the main one and it's FAQ told me it doesn't support resume on xdcc transfers. Pathetic. The only feature I find missing from Opera's irc is the ability to set a default download directory, but otherwise it's pretty good.

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